Red Light Therapy: Anti Aging, Energy, and Recovery- A Better Life Podcast

of my dear friends and comrades that I admire so much and respected for I don’t

know Jim what has it been like 18 almost 20 years now and we’re getting older and

I think we’re getting prettier though. I think it’s it’s been it’s been a minute. I think working out all right for both

of us, but Jim Labal is on with me today and I wanted to bring uh to light here,

no pun intended, a topic that I think everybody’s asking a lot of questions about. I’m asking a lot of questions

about. You know, I have an inflammatory disorder and I don’t want to age either. I mean, I want to stay young forever.

So, uh red light therapy, that’s what we’re all trying to do, right? So,

Oh, yeah. Yeah, Red Light Therapy and you are one of my go-tos for all the

wonderful advice on anti-aging and metabolic health and all and so give us

uh give us an update on things for you first of all. What’s going on in your world and new and and wonderful?

Oh, I mean there’s just so much happening right now. So, you know, new

it won’t be called Metabolic Code Book. It’s got, you know, a new uh title to it, but it’s basically Metabolic Code

2.0. I know. Yeah, that’s an update on all the chemistry of what we learned over the last 20 years.

Although the last book still seems current, when people read it, they go, “Wow, this is pretty much right on.” But

kind of taking things into the next 20 years. Probably be the uh my opus book. And then we’ve got a book on um blood

tests for performance. Uh that is in the editorial. All right. Trying to finish up my second edition of

Your Blood Never Lies. There you go. So, I got a lot lot of book stuff happening. Obviously, the

Instagram’s popping, you know, working with my son on that. So, that’s great. And, uh, you know, obviously we’re real

busy with um, Lifetime and putting together the longevity centers there, which include

red light therapy. So, uh, you know, pretty, you know, staying pretty busy. Got a lot of lot of work

going on the liposomaal tableting technology on the far on the pharmaceutical side. So, I think that’s about it.

try to work out, try to stay fit, you know. Can you add anything else? Oh my gosh.

The busiest person I’ve ever known right here sitting right in front of you there. Well, well, and uh the Instagram

is the real Jim Laval in case anybody wants to go look you up. But I will have that on my website so that people can

can uh hook up and then as soon as your books come out, I’m going to list those too and make sure that people have access. Great book. Great great great

book. So, well, great. All right. So jumping in red light therapy kind of what is it and why is it becoming so

popular? Yeah. So red light therapies the the other term for it is uh

photobiomodulation right so light waves right

and uh and then how it modulates tissues when you’re you know you’re in a

particularly a red light bed. Yeah. And so it really, you know, red light therapy is interesting because

there’s different wavelengths of light, right? So there’s a couple different ones. I mean,

I’m just going to just to say it right out front in case somebody cuts out of here quick is,

you know, you want to have two wavelengths. So two wavelengths. One should be in like the mid600s and the

other one in the mid 800s. So, if you’re looking at getting a red light therapy,

those are the two recommended frequencies. And some people, it’s got to be 620 and 840,

right? You know, 8 800, 840, you know, 600 to

650, you’re going to be okay. Good. Now, so red light therapy has a variety

of benefits. So the first thing is if there’s shorter wavelengths, so like the

600’s, that’s more oriented at your skin

stimulating collagen. So you know, you talked about wanting to age better. So if you have crepey, you know, you get

crepey skin on your on your legs and your on your arms as you’re getting older, you know. Uh yeah. Yuck. Uh

obviously you can do things like use OSO1 cream which uh is a peptide that’s showing up to be really good for crepey

skin. Oh great. Why not do that and add red light therapy? So indeed

red light therapy uh stimulates collagen synthesis. So when you use red light

therapy and those short wavelengths the whole purpose of that is is to stimulate

your collagen production in your skin. of course, improve collagen um production. It’s going to be less less

lines, less wrinkles, less crepiness, you know. So, you’ll see people get with

a red light face m face mask to to use that for their face.

Uh and then you can get in a whole body uh red light therapy. Now, typically a

whole body red light therapy, if you’re getting in one of those clamshells, you would want to think about covering

your eyes. You don’t want to have your eyes wide open when you’re doing it. Um, otherwise, I know I got one of those red

light therapy almost like matte beds where it’s two red light uh basically

blankets that you cover yourself. So, I mean, it’s it’s pretty interesting

everything it does. So, one thing that it does is it stimulates nitric oxide production,

so you get better circulation into your tissues. The other one that’s pretty

interesting is that it helps to stimulate ATP production. So basically you’re going to make more energy.

Pretty interesting. And then the third piece of it. So if you want to think about the the princ the three big areas of benefit, you

know, you have skin why is nitric oxide important? Well, if you ever listen to Nathan Bryan and a

lot of people have listened to Nathan and his and his work on nitric oxide, right? As you get older, you lose nitric oxide

production. Yeah. So, being able to stimulate your tissues to make nitric oxide, fantastic.

Obviously, there’s nutrients you can take for that. Um, and then ATP production. Look, as we get older, our

mitochondria just don’t function like they used to, and that’s going to make you more fatigued, and you’re not going to you’re going to make more lactic

acid. You’re going to get more sore after a workout. Hence one of the other

benefits of this which I know we’ll get to is you know great for post exercise

soreness, muscle aches, joint aches, really nice for that.

Um and then the other piece is it helps to repair your cells. So literally you

get an improvement at the cellular level on repair processes which makes sense

because you can’t really like boost your ATP without repairing your mitochondria.

Absolutely. So that’s a real quick real quick down and dirty. That was a lot of info right there.

It is. But it’s great. Those are big those are big areas when you think about aging. So talking about

aging gracefully, right? Like I’m still I’m still 65. Yeah. Um,

nitric oxide essential because what what that means for the folks out there is

that your blood vessels dilate better and you’re going to get more blood flow deeper into your tissues.

Yes. And why that’s important is you’re carrying oxygen deeper into your tissues, which is awesome. And that’s

gonna also mean you can get rid of the byproducts of your metabolism uh much more easily the better your

micro capillaries are expanding. Yes. So that’s you know that’s huge you know

and it goes without saying you know if if you have improved ATP synthesis

and you have improved mitochondrial function that you know mitochondria is the basis of all health right so when

you hear about mitochondrial health um and there’s some cool tests that you can do for that now but it it really has

to do with your resiliency because you need your mitochondria pumping that ATP pee out

even when you get a cold or flu. Absolutely. So yeah, energy for working out, energy for daily life,

and remember all chronic degenerative diseases have a mitochondrial

failure component to some extent or another.

So that’s kind of the the quick down and dirty to get us all excited about why

red light therapy matters. Absolutely. And it does. And so I’ve been using it a lot lately in the

blanket form uh that you discussed. And so I know that there are like you mentioned the face mask, but panels some

people set something on their desk or you know build a room or so. What is the best really the best way to do it?

I you know I think I’m a fan of using the blanket because it’s it whole body

and then you can get by on less time and get more effect. Yeah. So, you know, you think about how much

you should do it. Um, right. You know, it it it it varies, but

honestly, you know, there’s a kind of a ramp up phase and then there’s the maintenance phase.

Sure. And now the other piece that I think’s important is they’ve even shown that it

can improve brain health. Now obviously those those wavelengths are a little bit higher but at the same time you know

this thought of using light as therapy it only makes sense. Think of the power

of just getting in the sunlight in the morning and activating your circadian rhythm. Right. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. Lately I’ve

been getting out in the, you know, kind of the first light morning sun you know that has changed my life as far as

circadian rhythm. Get up easier. My energy’s better. And so, yeah, I I believe in that.

Well, you’re out in the you’re out in the tundra getting all that great morning sun. I mean,

it’s not even fair. You can bottle that and send it off. Sell it. I will. You bet. It’s pretty amazing

idea. So, so the thing that that like just to keep in mind, why do you want both of

those types of frequencies? remember the the the near infrared or like the 700 to

1100 range I was talking about getting in that 800ish range. Y that goes deeper into your tissues.

Okay. Yeah. So that’s the one that really helps with like decreasing inflammation in the

muscles, helping with reducing inflammatory signaling even related to your nerves.

And so you know you activate the mitochondria. very cool. But it also helps with just

activating your intracellular calcium channels and then helping to kind of regulate

oxidative reduction reactions. So pretty, you know, pretty important. I think you should do both. Obviously, the

older you get, you’re exercising, you’re active. I mean, yesterday I was doing leaves and all kinds of stuff and, you

know, I was, you know, I got in at the end of that 4hour journey and I was like, “Wow, my back’s a little sore.

Maybe I’m going to lay on that red light bed.” Amen. Took care of it. So, I mean, I was

pretty excited about that. And, you know, you you can get I think it’s real important to understand

timing. Yeah. Like how, you know, how should you use it? So, I mean, we can go through the,

you know, all the, you know, the big things that you that relate to muscle and what it is good for, what it isn’t

good for, but honestly, you start out probably four to five times a week.

Okay? Typically, usually 15 minutes is adequate, especially if you’re laying on

a whole body. 15 to 20 minutes. Yep. And then, you know, at maintenance you can go down to three times a week unless

you’re working on some specific other issues. But typically it’ll, you know,

three times a week is usually enough. Once you achieve kind of, hey, I’m hey, I’m not sore so much. Gee, my skin has

changed. It’s really improved. You can, you can bring that amount of time down or the frequency that you do it. So,

that part is, you know, really important. And look, this is like tendonopathies.

Yeah. I mean fibromyalgia this is like a game changer game changer.

Absolutely. Now what you know it won’t fix a tear right so like if you have a tear you know a

tear is a tear osteoarthritis where you’re getting bone on bone it’s not going to fix that but will you

help to alleviate the inflammation as a result of that? Yep. You’ll you know you’ll probably notice

less pain. Um but you know more and more people were exercising as you as you and

I are absolutely you know I would say addicts to exercise.

Absolutely. Thank you. We we love we love our exercise. Call it what it is.

And and you know it it really that’s even been shown to improve grip strength.

Wow. Increase speed. Yeah, I mean it has it literally has physical

performance attributes to it in addition to immuno regulating. So when we talked

about skin, it’s no little thing that immune regulation that’s occurring and collagen synthesis is occurring helps in

you know skin conditions like psoriasis. So you’re seeing people using it on the immune side and improving that quality

of skin. Absolutely. And then I mean I don’t want to once again in general I find a lot of

people are overtraining nowadays like they’re spending it’s hard to believe I know we hear you you can’t overtrain you

can only under recover right so there’s the advocates that are like you just can’t overtrain you just

don’t recover good enough well this really helps on that recovery cycle and why that’s so

important is you you reduce your risk of injury you know if you get those infl inflammatory compounds out of the tissue

and the achiness and the lactic acid and the oxidative stress. Yeah, you move that around quicker,

you’re going to recover quicker, you’re going to uh create less damage or getting that delayed onset muscle

soreness or doms as known as. you can clear that stuff out quicker. And you

know, I think those are really important, especially as you’re trying to stay active as you age because for both of us, we know,

you know, muscle’s the currency of longevity. You you know, the more more

you more you keep that muscle on, the better off you’re going to be. So that those are some of the big areas

that I think are important. Um just about everything really. And so is there a situation, right? Not most. It’s

just like the miracle. And so, oh my gosh, I tell people, you know, no, not any one thing is a miracle, but it’s

nice to, you know, combine these factors with other things. And so, is there something that you combine red light

therapy with, you know, maybe from a supplement aspect or um, you know, on the on the inflammatory and on the

collagen side? Sure. So, the one thing I’ll I’ll mention is if you’re on medications that

would make you photosensitive, you should be really careful. Gotcha. So, you know, tetrayclines,

other drug therapies may make you more photosensitive. So, you should just be aware of that. Make sure if you’re on

medication, look up if any of them cause photosensitivity because that could create a negative reaction. So, that’s a

big one. Um, so, uh, things that you could take. So

one, if you’re interested in mitochondrial repair, right,

or mitochondrial function, nicotenomide ribocide or naggen is, you know, well

proven to help improve uh NAD levels and therefore improve mitochondrial capacity. Obviously, the,

you know, the go-to standards on that are things like CoQ10. If you’re looking

at a peptide, recently approved drug is a peptide called SS31.

All right? Which is a mitochondrial peptide. Now, you can look at,

you know, like there’s key things about mitochondria you can’t avoid. You need B1,

you need B2, right? You kind of need all the B vitamins to really help that. And the other one that people don’t

recognize is magnesium. Absolutely. Magnesium helps mitochondrial production of ATP.

So you’ve got those you’ve got those key nutrients. The other one I would say if you’re thinking about mitochondrial health is

phospholipids. So phosphotidylcholine, phosphocarerene, you think of the phospholipids because

they help keep the cell membrane intact and the mitochondrial membrane intact

because what happens when your mitochondria get damaged, you start getting electrons leaking out of there and that just creates free radical

damage. So you want to repair all that. Yep. And the PQQ pyroquinolone kone re is a

mitochondrial catalyst. It’s a dietary supplement. Um, so vitamin C of course.

Yeah. Uh, but but then we get on to collagen. Yeah. Um,

yeah. So, collagen. I mean, copper peptide is amazing. You can use that topically. Topically.

Uh, really good. Obviously, you take collagen, man. I’m on to this new collagen that’s about to

hit the market. Yeah. That’s a fish peptide derived collagen.

So they’re polyeptides that are derived from, you know, basically enzyatically

treating the byproducts of the salmon industry. And there’s some really good evidence of how effective the collagen

is utilized. Okay. Um versus kind of like the traditional, you know, collagen peptides. When you’re

taking collagen, always good to make sure you’re taking vitamin C. You got to have got to make sure you got adequate

vitamin D for skin integrity. Absolutely. Um, and then probably the I mean the biggest thing for the skin is

just making sure your microbiome isn’t is is doing health. Yes. Yeah. Gut health’s at the center of like

I’ve done a lot of lectures at gosh der like you know the uh dermatology

conferences lately that relate to that whole gut skin interaction. finally recognizing that,

you know, hey, it’s something on the inside causing problems on the outside and that’s why that’s occurring and and you

know, so and and that and so those are the key things that I like to recommend. What do you have any other ones you like

to recommend? You know, I don’t know lately there’s been a lot of talk about methylene blue.

So, what do you think about methylene blue and mitochondria? I I really like methylene blue. Yeah,

it’s great. I I would say the only thing I would say on methylene blue, it’s probably good to go on and go off of it.

Unless you’re doing like active cancer treatment where they’re using methylene blue to activate or increase the

efficacy of the treatment that you’re doing. Probably a good idea. Like if you fly, taking methylene blue, good idea to take

it before you fly, right? Um so that that’s good. And then of course doing it chronically is really

good. I I tend to have people do it for maybe you know four to eight weeks on and four weeks

off just just because you you know there’s some thought that you you need to take breaks from methylene blue.

Um but I love methylene blue. I think it’s a you know obviously you got to get

the right kind of methylene blue. Uh you can’t go buy fish food uh you know or

aquarium tank methylene blue. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. You need you need the the

USPG grade methylene blue which I know you know that I’m telling the

telling our audience. Thank you. Yes. You’ll buy anything. Don’t squirt the you know the

antioxidant from the fish tank into you. Oh my goodness. Absolutely. I think

that’s one of the bigger things that I use. Of course I I check everybody’s methylation. So you said mentioned the bees though and all the methylolate,

methyl B12 and whatnot. So yeah, that’s that’s pretty much my list as I know collagen, taking collagen is a big one.

Um, you know, a lot of people add it to their, you know, add it to their shakes or, you know, take the the and, uh, I

know there’s all sorts of grades of good on that one, too. And of course, you’ve always got the latest and greatest

before everybody else gets it, but what’s a good version of it that you like to tell, you know, maybe your

patients are metabolic, metabolic, type two, type four. I don’t have one.

metabolic. I mean, type two collagen, type four collagen, you know, those are the, you know, the ones that are going

to be good. And everybody’s like, “Oh, you need to use fish.” No, you need chicken trachea. No,

I think in general, when you think of collagen, what what do you need to make good collagen? Well,

there’s two amino acids you need mainly. Hydroxyproline and proline,

which are very rich in collagen. So if you’re you know those why those are important they help with what’s called

the cross-linking of your fibers of your your skin and your you

know in order to make the integrity of your skin. So that along with vitamin C it’s really

good to take if you’re doing collagen either if you’re doing it in a smoothie

take a vitamin C capsule with it and uh a that’s going to help with recovery from exercise. Yeah. B, that’s going to

help with the incorporation of the hydroxyproline and proline. So, got pretty pretty um, you know, pretty solid

when you start taking that and doing red light therapy, adding the antioxidant benefits, you can really see significant

differences in your skin. Now, the thing that everybody says related to red light

therapy, and I think taking supplements helps this, it’s about consistency.

Absolutely. And that’s probably the number one thing that I think, you know,

people get into doing a regiment, then they kind of tail off and they’re not doing it. It’s like, why isn’t my skin

better way? I haven’t worn a mask in a week, you know? You it it’s about creating a

regiment. And, you know, you got to pick and choose the regiments, you know, because before you

know it, you’re regimenting all day long and you, you know, you’re not getting to enjoy your life.

I’m kind of big on, you know, hey, we should, you know, you know, pick out the things. But I got to tell you, I think

red light therapy is at the top of the, you know, is one of the top things that you can do.

Absolutely. Um, without a doubt. Absolutely. And so on uh on that note

too, you mentioned about lab tests for mitochondrial health. I know a lot of doctors don’t do, you know, lab testing

or even sometimes recognize that there’s much uh about mitochondrial health, but what kind of testing do you usually

recommend? Well, if you want to really get the like gold standard test, which wouldn’t feel

too good. That would be a punch biopsy of your muscle. I don’t know we want to do that.

Run the other way. But yeah, but uh interestingly interesting researchers at University of California

San Diego uh Heml Patel actually they developed a finger prick uh that tests

for mitochondrial function multiple 17 different categories of mitochondrial

function it’s pretty interesting yeah it’s called the MI screen me

okay and it’s really interesting it gives you kind of the how much electron leakage is

going on. What’s the health of or status of the mitochondria? Yeah.

You know, it really gives you a a complete picture of, you know, where is your mitochondrial status? And

I think that’s a real innovation that’s happened just came out this year. Wow.

So, that’s a very it’s a very interesting and new test that I think is, you know, I think it’s going to be

one of those things that are invaluable as you move forward with, hey, am I really getting somebody well?

Yeah. Yeah. You know, because obviously if the healthier the mitochondria in general, the healthier you’re going to be.

Absolutely. I still would not look at that as, oh, that’s the test that you can, you know, hey, put your, you know, that’s how you

true up your health. Sure. Still got to look at glucose. Still got to look at lipid. You still got to look at inflammatory markers in your

bloodstream because sometimes those things are shifting, you know, causing a problem before it’s

distilling down into really damaging the mitochondria. So, it depends how good you feel or how ill you feel.

Yeah, I’m glad you brought that up because like I said earlier, you know, there’s no one thing that’s a miracle and and most people here the latest and

greatest will jump on that bandwagon forgetting that it’s a headtotoe issue. You know, there are many many things

that you have to uh do together to, you know, encompass good health. And so is

there anything that you know is there any way that red light therapy other

than you know the medicines that you’re taking and photosensitive and whatnot is there any reason why you wouldn’t do it? Is there any harm?

Uh I mean I think in general it’s it’s safe. I mean, I I think if if

um if you have a specific condition, you

know, medical condition, and you’re concerned, you can always, you know, look it up.

You can ask your doc, you can find out if there’s an issue. But my biggest concern is the is kind of

that red flag of, you know, you’re on medications. Yeah. and you’re, you know,

you’re, you know, you’re don’t realize it’s a photobiomodulating, you know, issue,

right? You got to be really careful because you can really irritate your skin in a big way.

Absolutely. Yeah. Well, good. That’s uh I haven’t really found any any reason

for people not to. I find sometimes though that uh people when they first

start it sometimes can feel worse before they feel better. So, Well, you know, that that makes sense

though, right? right? Um, kind of detoxify and get uh get some of

the junk out getting all that lactic acid out of your tissues. I mean, you know, you you probably wouldn’t do

it I mean, if we get real specific, you probably wouldn’t do it with active skin cancer,

right? It’ be pretty irritated, right? Yeah. Um, you wouldn’t want red light

therapy like where you’re getting it on your eyes because it might trigger like if you’re epileptic, you know how

blinking red lights or red light therapies could trigger something. It’s not that it’s bad for epilepsy. It’s

just that that might be the case. Sure. Um maybe maybe lupus. I don’t you know

it’s like a it’s a maybe. But uh you know I think those would be the biggest

things because I I actually think of you know, immunotherapies, like

autoimmunity, like why wouldn’t you want to use this because you’re regulating, you know, the, you know, your regulating

the mitochondria. I don’t really see how that could be an issue, but but if you’re really like, hey, there’s the

biggest concerns, like if you had an active skin cancer, um, you should probably, you know, check

in on that for sure. Yep. And then obviously do a little bit of research on whether or not, you know,

any other conditions might be a problem if you if you have one. But I have not seen anything that’s absolutely

real significant. Absolutely. And so I know it it can help uh kind of underlying uh like we

mentioned sitting out in the sunlight, you know, circadian rhythm or whatnot. I find people sleep a lot better when they

use red light therapy, too. So I find a circadium help and I think that’s underlying mitochondrial, but it’s uh

yeah, even even help there as well. Well, you know, it’s that’s interesting because I’m I had a I did a really odd

odd thing. I hadn’t been doing barbell squats in a while and I decided I’m going to do barbell squats. I’m going to

elevate my feet. I’m going to go down real deep. All of a sudden, I was into my fourth set of them, which, you know,

I hadn’t done them in a long time. Now, this this could be classified as stupid.

Uh, but I I woke up in the middle of the night and I was literally

um absolutely sore and achy and tight. I went in my

red light bed. I I went in there and I laid down for 30 minutes, turned it on, and I literally then I jumped back in

bed, fell asleep. Yeah. Next day I was totally clear. Wow. Nice.

Totally clear. Nice. Well, good. Well, that uh that is helpful. The soreness and like you say,

the lactic acid and all that is that is uh in the middle of the night. I can’t imagine you dragging out your red light therapy blanket, but that is perfect.

You should Oh, it’s set up on my bed. Oh, good. as your bedspread maybe. Yeah. Well,

awesome. Absolutely. For those watching, don’t worry. Jim is still here. We’re talking, but uh but

this is really a great uh a great uh coverage of of red light therapy. Again, lots of benefits, no major reasons why

uh you shouldn’t do it. There are a few. So, always check with your provider. We always want to be cautious about those things individually. But uh but anything

else, Jim? What else can you think of that we may have left out? I can’t think of much. You’ve really covered this very

well. Thank you. Yeah. No, I mean, I thought, you know, I wanted to come in prepared and kind of

give people the, hey, here’s the two light therapy ranges. Remember, if you’re listening,

600s, 800s, that that that’s kind of the one that you can’t go wrong on.

Absolutely. Um, and and then just don’t overdo it. Right. Right.

Those are the two ways. And then all the other things that I had mentioned, uh, look, uh, make it happen,

right? Get you can get a panel. You can I I like the bed personally, but you can

get panels. There’s a lot of ways that you can incorporate red light therapy. Absolutely. Is there now that is

something too, you know, there are a lot of different brands uh of them. Um, you

know, we don’t we don’t really market or or you know, we’re not paid by anybody to recommend brands or anything, but is

there one because I know there should be some concern. There may be some that aren’t very good out there and you

should be cautious about, but is there any uh one or two brands that you would recommend?

Uh, I mean, um, Mellin, Mel,

is kind of a a nice brand. Y there’s a variety of the the panels that

are out there, but I mean I’ I’ve been referring people to Mellin just because

price is really reasonable and uh and you know they you know they

they work great and they’re in the right fields of uh light. So all right, good to combine this even with like if

you’re doing infrared sauna, right? Nice combination if you do do sauna with it. Very good.

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And those those are things that you can access at home or you know I know uh I have a a

trainer my trainer Sonia has an infrared sauna sauna so we do that right after you know exercise and and so lots of

great uh combinations there. So good I mean the rundown is uh we know the ranges to get how to do it uh how long

to stay in it and and work up to it. Uh great list of of uh benefits and risks

pros and cons and and uh supplements and labs and things like that. Jim, I think you’ve covered it all as usual. I really

appreciate it. Um, any final words for everybody out there and then one more thought about how to find you.

Uh, the real Jim Lval on Instagram is the easiest. Obviously, jiml.com. They

can look up metabolic code if they’d like. Metabolic.com. Yep. Uh, and of course, obviously I’m chief

science officer of Lifetime, so they got a whole bunch of stuff about me kind of being printed and getting out there into

the media. Now, that’s about it. Final thought is take the next step. Think of one thing that

you are doing in your habits that you know is not good for your health.

Correct. Try to change it. Absolutely. And one a week. Just take one habit a week and and start that

change. But that’s wonderful advice as always. Jim, thank you. It’s always a

pleasure to have you on and an honor. And if uh anybody has any questions, we’ve got some previous shows, too. Go

to drpetlife.com, check those out. And uh I think that’s

it. Hopefully we’ll have you on again. And uh I hope everybody has a fantastic week. Please take care of each other out

there.